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24/05/2005: "Anothy Gatto and Jay Gilligan: A frank Discussion"

Jay Gilligan has a website/blog called Building Weight. On the 12th and 14th of March he unleashed a tirade of words bagging out the current climate of juggling in the world. Anyway, it's a great read if you're into juggling. If not it's probably really really confusing. click [more] for the entire "eassy". (i've transcribed it to my blog for preservation purposes.) As for far as i can tell. It is in response to an internet backlash against Anthony Gatto (argueably the best juggler alive) and the FAQ on his website. I have attached the faq to the bottom of Jay gilligan's rant just so i have it somewhere. If you want to read it either go to his website and click fans section and click FAQ. Otherwise read Jay then read Anthony by clicking [extended entry].

It was really interesting to see the internet creating an "instant" juggler culture wereas Jay would ilke to see people respect/known and learn old school juggling, WOO, that was heavy reading. PEACE OUT

TRANSCRIBED FROM WW.BUILDINGWEIGHT.COM written by Jay Gilligan
03/12/2005
I would like to throw my hat into the ring as it were by sharing some thoughts about the current culture of juggling in America. These theories are based in part upon public letters Anthony Gatto has published on his website. If you haven’t already visited his site, please do so before continuing on below. The address is www.anthonygatto.com, choose to enter the “fan” section.

I would like to start by discussing my experience growing up and learning how to juggle. The environment surrounding the juggling culture in America was very different than today’s equivalent. I learned to juggle at age 9, which meant the year was 1986. Soon after I attended my first IJA festival in 1987. 1988 was the first year a complete “festival video” was produced- instead of merely documenting the event the video tried to capture the “feeling” and “energy” of the week’s activities. This is the first point I like to document as the start of the multimedia culture that has so drastically shaped today’s juggling community.

At the same time video production was being revamped, the content to be captured on the video was much more embedded in tradition. The late 80’s and early 90’s were ruled by friendly rivalry among many familiar faces that had been around for years in the “scene”. Most notably in the teams area, The Raspyni Brothers, The Passing Zone, and Doubble Troubble, pushed each other to develop technically as well as trying to find more entertaining ways to present their new tricks. There was a depth to the culture by having more than one team consistently visible in the community and on stage. The growing popularity of the festival videos meant anyone could watch and learn the latest developments in the juggling world without leaving home. An amateur juggling such as myself at the time could study, compare, and contrast the newest techniques and performance ideas even if I could not attend the festivals in person. This was a much better improvement over only a few years earlier where the fastest way to learn about what moves your friends were doing was to go visit them. However, the spread of video was still slower than today’s option of the “instant internet”. Along with this new “instant” culture as I call it, came new “instant” jugglers.

Let me back up a bit and explain my ideas. Each year the IJA festival would come along and focus the juggling culture in America for one week. The festival was a benchmark in the juggling year- a time to meet new people, learn new tricks, but also to connect to the larger community and peer group. As we all know, the easiest way to start out with juggling is to imitate others. An underdeveloped technique set has enough trouble just keeping the objects in the air, let alone creating entirely new patterns. Of course these are generalities and there are exceptions at every step, but for the most part everyone I know including myself started out by doing what they saw in front of them. And what we saw 15 to 20 years ago were people who worked harder each year to come back and try to position themselves at the top of the pile. The Raspyni Brothers invented throwing tomahawks in a 6 club one count. The next year The Passing Zone came and did the same trick but used one hand on each juggler to throw tomahawks instead of having only one team member do the new type of throw. There was a linear progression that could be traced back for years by merely paying attention to the “top” jugglers in the community. The resulted thinking by my young mind was that technique takes years to learn! Hard work, dedication, and an active mind were all needed to take your juggling to the next level.

Not only technique was being spread around this way. Performance ideas also developed quickly as the videos got passed around. This most notably took shape when the late Sean McKinney started using music with lyrics in his competition sets. His onstage choices came around the exact same time as the video explosion. The results over the next few years were Junior competitors coming from all corners of the country, competing for their first time at their first convention, and using music with lyrics (which was too large a break from tradition to suggest that each new Junior act was shockingly innovative). So, even though the developments in the world of juggling were being spread around at a higher speed, there was still a sense of tradition and context for the new ideas.

Juggler’s World magazine and new prop manufacturers also contributed to an expanding base and higher levels were set as the average skill set. You often hear people talk about attending festivals in the late 70’s and they mention that back then there were only one or two jugglers at most in attendance who could hold up a five club pattern. Today you see at least half of the people throwing 5 clubs or 7 balls. Obviously this is because younger jugglers now think that 5 club juggling is not that hard. They see everyone else doing it so why shouldn’t they? This brings me back to my point of the “instant” culture. The juggling youth look around and see 5 club jugglers so they try their hand at that. But what they don’t see is any of the “greats” of the past.

When I started attending festivals Anthony Gatto still made appearances. I got to watch him practice and perform several times. I know what he was and is capable of. I saw it with my own two eyes. With the invasion of the internet, and the majority of users online being too young to have seen Anthony in person, rumors fly wild all the time. It is literally the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard when people post about being better technically than Anthony. The cold, hard fact is that Anthony is the best juggler there ever was. He is also the best juggler currently and will remain so as far as can be known now. There is currently no one in this world who could ever match what he can do with technical juggling, no matter how much they practice the rest of their lives. Let me repeat that- unless someone is born tomorrow who grows up to be better than Anthony, then no one currently juggling anywhere in the world today will ever duplicate, even by practicing 24 hours a day the rest of their lives, the feats Anthony is able to do everyday in practice and performance. You may think this is an extreme statement and that I am blindly devoting my faith to Anthony as some sort of nostalgic inaccurate recollection. This is because you have not seen Anthony practice. It’s that simple. You will be hard pressed to get me to concede that anyone will even come close ever to being as good as Anthony with just one prop. Forget that he does all three. Show me just one person with just one prop- either balls, rings, or clubs- who can even come a little bit close to what Anthony does every day. Seriously, email me right now and tell me who you think has skills anywhere close to Anthony: jaygilligan@buildingweight.com

Another prime example of the change in juggling culture can be seen in the team juggling genre. Team Rootberry is the most recent team “institution” America has. As always I am talking generally mainly about jugglers outside of the “Benji-bot” world as they don’t count in real society. This is another argument we can get into in a later essay. For now I will say the “Benji” mafia is based upon politics and a cruise ship monopoly. These things are irrelevant enough to our discussion of the real juggling culture that we can ignore him and his students for now. Team Rootberry made several appearances on the IJA stage over the course of a few years. Their “rise” was very “old-school” in nature. However, even at the top of their game, their technical achievements were not as high as juggling teams of the past. Doubble Troubble was passing 11 clubs in the gym in St. Louis in 1991. They passed 10 clubs on stage. The Passing Zone passed 8 clubs back to back on stage in 1989, and 9 clubs back to back on the Renegade stage in 1993. The reason for the current drop in technique may be due to a few factors. One is that in 1989-93 Team Rootberry were not even juggling yet as far as I know. They never got a chance to see and take part in the technical revolution of that era. The second reason may be that there was never another peer juggling team to push them during their learning process. (There were other teams contemporary of Rootberry when Rootberry was starting out who were technically more proficient than them. However, these people were “Benji Clones” and the politics involved with that negate any sort of real argument for influencing the general juggling population). Also I suspect another very important point may be what Anthony is alluding to on his website. The state of the entertainment industry changing from gala and variety to corporate events. Technique no longer being a factor in paying your rent.

There is nothing wrong with any of this except for how this all relates to the “instant” jugglers out there. I would now like to conclude by explaining the effects of the internet on contemporary juggling in America (and a bit around the world) as I see it. I’ve already noted that younger jugglers copy what they see. And currently there has not been as much tradition or heritage for them to see. Perhaps the markets currently needed to be frequented to get paid also prevent the higher caliber of juggler from attending the festivals and therefore also not appear on the juggling videos that still get passed around. So what younger jugglers absorb are videos they see on the internet. These videos tend to distort the culture by being deceivingly easy to make. With the price of technology so low now, anyone who wants to can set up a video camera and post videos online. There are instant feedback opportunities through website guestbooks and online forums.

What the videos don’t show are any sort of consistent technique base. An example of this can more easily be seen by relating a story, not about an online video, but rather an online photo. I went to a juggler’s website and saw this beautiful promotional picture of seemingly 7 club juggling. The pattern looked great- nice and big and technically accurate. A few months later I had the chance to meet and practice with this juggler. I was shocked to find that even a consistent 5 club cascade was beyond the juggler’s abilities let alone 6 or the photographed 7 clubs! Nevertheless the juggler happily flailed 7 clubs into the air repeatedly for hours on end. I can’t fault someone for trying 7 or for being happy about not catching them ever. I also can’t fault someone for having a great looking photo online, everyone has to pay the rent and eat. I’m all for promotion. The problem comes when others who are part of the new “instant” culture look at the picture and then instantly assume they are looking at a 7 club juggler. In this way I can imagine that people online think I am insane for saying no one will ever be better than Anthony. If you believe all the hype and self-promotion online then it seems everyone will be the next Anthony!

There may be good parts to the online community- a few years ago someone with a great base technique set (someone who had learned juggling the old-fashioned way) started to flash 11 balls. Younger jugglers saw this and, like they did with 5 clubs so long ago, started to try it themselves. Now you can find a number of videos online where people flash 11 balls. And I am not saying these people are not talented or that this doesn’t contribute to the culture. However, the trick with video is that you can try the 11 ball flash again and again. And again. And again. What people sometimes fail to have is the perspective it takes to watch and assimilate these jugglers into the proper cultural context. I propose that many of the people I know, of all ages, could flash 11 balls if they 1). used the small wisps of beanbags in place of balls 2). spend one solid year with only 11 balls in their hands at any time 3). have a video camera rolling non-stop for the one off chance they catch the balls 4). practice or do nothing else with their time except work towards the goal of catching the trick once on camera. Once again, I am not saying this is a bad thing if you happen to enjoy doing it. I personally cannot see the point in it, other than to create a false image of your juggling abilities online.

Or to be more precise perhaps this is where the argument turns into the whole hobbyist vs. the professional performer thing. Except that you can’t even just stop there with professional performing as a broad definition anymore. It used to be that this type of argument could easily be laid to rest using the old “but you’re performing for an audience and they don’t care if its 5 or 6 rings, they just want you to eat an apple anyway so technique doesn’t matter” line of thought. But now a new organization called the WJF has come into existence to promote juggling as a sport. One of the competitors in the WJF told me one part of their agenda is to create a market for sport juggling, with one facet being that there could be paid professional sport jugglers in the future.

While this is still a performance debate (instead of just being a hobbyist and staying at home in front of your video camera), the question of “on demand” technique comes into play. The “instant” jugglers of today would be hard pressed to do their feats “on demand”. Most of the jugglers who have flashed 11 balls on the internet have not juggled 10. They have not even juggled 9. Some not 8. Maybe 7. Maybe 13 catches of 6. Once. On film. And that is just with balls. We are not talking about clubs and rings too. This all contributes to the current lack of depth in the juggling culture in America. The WJF was hard pressed to find technically inspiring performances in my opinion. I’m not saying they didn’t try. I’m not saying I could do better. I’m not saying they shouldn’t try or that they didn’t succeed on many levels. But where were all the 11 ball jugglers? Where were all the people who can beat Anthony or come close? You could argue they weren’t invited or they didn’t show up or that this whole line of thinking is irrelevant to my point since it’s the WORLD Juggling Federation and I am mainly talking about America, so why didn’t they just get better jugglers from anywhere they wanted? The fact is that we don’t know all the circumstances, or the who or the why or the politics or the money or whatever involved in the WJF competitor selection. But it doesn’t matter, the point remains that today’s “instant” jugglers are ill prepared for such an event.

This isn’t necessarily a bad thing except when people go online and post videos (this isn’t the bad thing yet) and then others contribute to the ignorance and watering down of the juggling culture in America (this is the bad thing) by perpetuating false rumors and making uneducated statements out of context that impressionable young minds then latch onto as the truth. To put it another way, they lack the historical and global (I mean large, not literally world wide) view of the art of juggling in which to make intelligent and useful statements about what they are seeing and/or promoting by adding fuel to the fire in the form of either comments or reactionary video posts. But this is not the responsibility of the culture to monitor the behavior of every individual. It is not the idea to censor anyone’s opinion or to argue over one way being right or wrong or better than another way. I merely wanted to express how I think we have gotten to the point (at least in America) where Anthony Gatto, the world’s greatest juggler, has to post on his website a plea for just a touch of sanity in today’s juggling culture.

03/14/2005
After re-reading my last entry, I wanted to clarify and expand a few points. I do not mean to sound as if I despise the internet nor its influence on the juggling arts. It is an extremely valuable tool that is helping to shape and influence the next generation of juggling on every level. At the very least I can concede that no one could read these thoughts with such ease if they were not online. I personally approach juggling with a very defined set of expectations. This does not mean that what I enjoy about juggling is the only valid reason to juggle. However, it is important perhaps to understand the context in which the rest of this letter will be framed. I am interested in juggling as an art form. This also includes the “craft” side of juggling, but further expands beyond pure technique or casual interest. I can completely understand that not everyone believes in juggling in the same way and that is perfectly fine.

For example, I like to go bowling but I am not fascinated in bowling as an art. I don’t study lane construction, different types of lane waxes, ball finishes, throwing feet pattern steps, or whatever other detail I find trivial to my enjoyment of this activity. I like to throw the ball down the lane and try to knock the pins over. After that I am not so concerned with the finer points involved. Of course I brag to anyone who will listen when I get a good score and beat my friend Henna but that is just another way I pass my time bowling since I don’t particularly care about the rules, the famous practitioners, or the “art” (or culture) of bowling. Using this as a guide, if someone asks me if I am a bowler I usually laugh a little and say, “well I’m not a bowler although occasionally I bowl.” This is just a symptom of my own personal distinction between the art and craft of bowling. Certainly I participate in the craft but I wouldn’t go as far to say I am a bowler. And I’m not this serious in real life. I don’t go around measuring each moment I am in to make sure I don’t commit a faux pas, but in this specific instance I believe I would reply as noted, although that may have more to do with my self esteem as a bowler than with my integrity. This analogy is already stretched way too thin but I have to add that others may in fact still call me a bowler even though by my definitions and choices I do not consider myself one. I am ok with that. This just further demonstrates the subjective and communal nature of all this talk.

Since I do enjoy exploring the past, present, and future of juggling, then I try my best to progress my personal work as much as possible in line with the art. For sake of argument I have to take my personal definitions of what the “art” actually is as well as how I define “best progress” since everyone’s experience is personally biased. Before I explain how I try to do this, I have to say that I do not believe this makes me any better or worse than anyone else who thinks the same or differently. This is just my opinion, ideas that I toss around inside my head sometimes, and totally disregard other times.

The way I try to work is by fitting my juggling into a historical context. This is because it really helps me to have some sort of frame in which to work. I tend to work in a linear fashion (please see other articles on this website) and I am basically lost until I find the beginning or end and am able to fill in the gaps. I also found this system of working has other advantages I did not grasp until later. So much of other art forms depend on context. The whole “readymade” art movement was based
upon the environment and trappings of the presentation. Duchamp took a toilet and put it in an art gallery, thereby calling it art. I dare to say that if Duchamp had not referenced and created his sculpture inside the context of art contemporary to his time, then we would not be talking about him still today. He recognized the established “system” and community his chosen field was built on. Even though he chose to reject many of the ideas popular at the time, he still had to be aware of the ideas before he could then twist them with his own unique expression. It is for this reason I find it important in my life to be aware of how things got to be the way they are in juggling. Plus of course I happen to really enjoy the process. It is often a very socially oriented task- meeting new friends, writing letters, talking on the phone, trading videos, visiting studios, watching shows.

Then fundamentally there are other reasons I see to be aware of my surroundings (artistically speaking). Company 111 from France debuted a show titled IJK a few years ago. You can find excerpts of this show on the DVD Bouncing in Paris. The jugglers in that show claim, most arrogantly in my opinion, that they invented juggling combined with music. And they honestly believe that they invented this “new art form” about 5 or 6 years ago. Now it is possible you could argue with me long enough so that I would be bored enough to agree with you that maybe, just maybe, they expanded on a few of the techniques of combining juggling with music, but in no way did they invent it! They had never heard of: The Flying Karamozov Jugglers who were doing musical juggling back in the late 70’s, Michael Moschen who made a rhythm piece inside a triangle, Dan Menendez who bounced balls on a piano in much the same way the Fyodor Karamazov did, Rudy Horn who force bounced 7 balls off a drum head creating a beat, Peter Davison with his piece "Rebound", Michael Menes with "Heinz Klaus", or what about Bobby May with his head stand and 5 ball bounce on a drum to the tune of Yankee Doodle Dandy? I am sure there are countless others you can think of that you have either personally seen or have read or heard about. Now, this type of ignorance is certainly fine by me. You can think whatever you want. Not everyone is interested in the history of juggling. Not everyone is interested in the worldwide community of jugglers. Not everyone is interested in progressing the art of juggling as a whole. And this is fine! But I just find it so boring. Especially when I talked to Cie 111 after their show and asked if they had ever seen Michael Moschen or the K’s, after they told me they had invented musical juggling with their show. They were not curious to hear about anything other than themselves. This was also a valid choice but it didn’t fit with my personal interest in the art of juggling. It is not in everyone’s ability to find the time or resources to research the art. It’s an ever-losing battle as new acts are created all the time all over the world. I am very lucky to get to travel a bit and meet a few people on the way who are kind enough to indulge my questions. For me it’s a hobby as well as a profession. Maybe if I had invented a new type of juggling like combining ball bouncing with other rhythms then maybe I would have enough work that I wouldn’t have the free time to know any better.

Of course jugglers can invent things independently of each other and it happens all the time. The problem then is when this independent discovery is thrust into the larger community and yet still tries to remain isolated. Another example: a friend of mine chose to work with two and a half meter long sticks. He was aware that Airjazz had created a piece using the same props years ago and they had achieved a bit of “fame” touring their performance around the world. I happened to be good friends with Jon Held and offered to show my stick friend a video of Airjazz which Jon had given me. New stick man said he didn’t want to see it in case he was tempted to “steal” some of their ideas. He said he wanted to create everything himself and that even if he “invented” something they had already done then at least he would not have a guilty conscience because he never saw their piece. I don’t really agree with this train of thought which I hear every so often. First of all, his resulting piece ended up looking pretty much like the Airjazz piece except a lot less intelligent and inventive. This could be due to the fact that I saw the Airjazz one first so some of the overlapping obvious technique sets were not so surprising the second time around. But basically I think the piece suffered from a lack of research and creativity. Sure, if you don’t see the Airjazz piece first then you can claim you made your piece in a vacuum. As long as you keep performing it in that same vacuum then it remains a relevant piece of art to the community since you are your own community. If instead the Airjazz video had been studied before or during the new creation then concepts could have been stretched further and with greater speed, providing more time for more original thought. Just because you see something and reference part of it or extrapolate on an idea does not immediately mean you are plagiarizing. Nor is it necessarily more interesting or fresh to see a naive piece of work than one that has been thought about. Besides, I find it ridiculous and impossible to ignore the mass culture out there.

If I show up at a juggling festival (or perform at a cabaret such as the stick man did) and bounce balls inside a large triangle, everyone in the global juggling community (and from other artistic and performing communities as well) will say that I ripped of Michael, even if the truth of the matter is I invented my act on my own in isolation. Some would say that I because of my “truth” I have the right to perform my act. Indeed I would have the right to perform the act but I would not have the right to get all indignant (or at least surprised) every time someone came up to me and asked why I stole the idea. I’m not sure of the correct course of action to take in this case, but the concept remains that the undeserved criticism is not without reason when anchored in the community at large. There is little you can do to convince me that no matter how much I change the presentation, costume, music, style, number of balls, material of construction, scale, or size of a ball bouncing triangle piece, people won’t think I ripped off Michael. As a side note, privately I don’t think I could deal with the aggravation even if I knew I was “right” and I would make another act. Then again, all I love to do is make new acts (please note I said “new”, not “good”) so that would be a good excuse.

I currently teach at Cirkus Cirkor in Sweden. Part of my job has me sitting on the selection committee to choose the next year’s incoming class. At the audition last year we had one juggler who performed using the new Babache oversized rings. Unfortunately for him, there is a very very famous juggler in Sweden using oversized rings who has been around for many years. The styles of the two acts were also extremely similar. More unfortunately, the boy auditioning had been attending the circus high school at Cirkor for three years. He was hard pressed to convince the jury, and eventually the president of the school, that he had not stolen his act. I talked to him afterwards and he was quite upset. But what could he expect? You have to know whom you are auditioning for! You have to be responsible and recognize the context in which you present your work.


In the same way, if I post a video in an online internet community and I expect people to respect my trick where I juggle 3 balls with my arms crossed one way for one beat, then uncross and cross them again for another beat, and then repeat this back and forth- who is going to #1: take this seriously and #2: say that the creation of this “new” trick advances or contributes anything to the world? I should definitely not be condemned for trying to invent something new. My lack of previous knowledge about the trick called Mills’ Mess should not ostracize or stigmatize me for the rest of my life. But if I fail to look at all the videos and books already out there, and then if I claim to be the “best/creative/superlative” juggler or whatever of my own culture I want to invent, based upon my own discovery of Mills’ Mess, then I should be prepared for some (valid) criticism. Maybe juggling culture doesn’t have such a problem with people “discovering” Mills’ Mess again and again, but when someone sees a video of Vova online doing 60+ catches of 7 clubs and then says Vova is technically better than Gatto, I think there is a slight glitch in the thinking there. You can of course say, “Who cares who is the best technical juggler? No one can say one is better than the other! Technical juggling is so boring- I like creativity! (thank you very open minded creative) Etc. etc.”. Well, I guess I care. And my friend Luke Wilson cares. The only thing I can try to do to contribute to juggling culture, which we’ve already established that I am interested in and not everyone is, is to try to be honest to myself and others and to try and show some respect for the art.

Its sincerely great that the impetus to post new videos on the internet has inspired people to challenge and grow in their abilities, not only technically but also creatively. A few solo club jugglers constantly ask the online community for new trick requests. The community then helps them out to give them both drive and inspiration, as well as feedback after the videos are posted. Another area of much activity seems to be 3 and 4 balls tricks. In much the same way trying to win the Junior’s Competition at the IJA festivals encouraged me to learn new skills, these 3 ball juggling sites provide a reason to keep developing themes and variations well beyond unaided interest. The trap then comes when you try to create your own mini-culture that fails to recognize the pre-existing culture. Just to laugh and say that even trying to discuss culture is pretentious and a waste of time doesn’t make the problem go away for everyone, it just erases it from your immediate view. Definitely you cannot care about how you fit into the world of juggling. You can ignore everyone else, or even just recognize the habits and trappings of small group of friends. My interest, the reason why I juggle and practice, does not find this path to be entertaining, intelligent, progressive, personally helpful, or enlightening, but then again I’m also not posting videos of myself bowling.
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WRITTEN BY JAY GILLIGAN
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TRANSCRIBED FROM WWW.ANTHONYGATTO.com

Q: How long is your daily practice session?

A: It depends on what I am working on. Right now I am working on some news props so it will last over 3 hours.

Q: Are you going to break anymore records?

A: Records are very boring to me but I break them because people seem to have some interest in it. Remember when I practice my runs on a daily basis they are always world records outside of the Gatto world.

Q: What is your exercise regimen?

A: After I finish the juggling I run for a fast mile then hit the weights for about 45 minutes.

Q: Is there any secret to advanced juggling?

A: Sure there is. Actually there are five key elements that you must pay attention to in order to become great. Sorry, you'll have to figure them out on your own. Remember, just because you can sing doesn't mean you can become a Pavarotti.

Q: Do you have any plans to attend juggling conventions in the future?

A: I can't say at this time. I have several projects on the table that require my full devotion.

Q: What is your favorite country to work?

A: I love to work in Germany. Sorry to say it America but they still understand art in Europe and are not consumed with what they see on television and in the movies. Americans would rather watch how many cockroaches a person can eat rather than how many clubs he can juggle. I can only hope that this mentality changes in the future but it's not looking to good for now. Europeans appreciate what I am portraying and I am grateful that there are still people in the world that get it.

Q: What is you favorite thing about juggling?

A: Performing it. There is nothing more gratifying then thunderous applause and standing ovations not to mention the happiness you can see reflecting in the eyes of your public.

Q: What is your least favorite thing about juggling?

A: What is has become. When I say this I am speaking about the people who have entirely missed out on what juggling really is about. So many people are concerned with being called the best, or one of the best, or second best or. the best if these forty other guys didn't exist or what ever their calling themselves but they fail to realize that the great ones don't give themselves titles. They pay their dues, they work the best venues, they become show stopping performers. Then there comes that point in time where the top venues advertise you on their own account based on the decades of performers they have witnessed and bill you as the greatest. Then there is a buzz throughout the entertainment world where you become known as a legend. It gets published in books by the people who make it their life's work to study these great artists. So friends call yourselves what you like and live with that little voice in the back of you head saying "I don't belong in this category" and remember clever people know the difference.

Q: What do you think about the WJF?

A: It's not my cup of tea but hey, if people are interested in juggling as a sport then why not have an event like this. It's another avenue for jugglers.

Q: Will you ever compete in the WJF?

A: No, as a professional and having won every major competition in the world and competed against the highest level of artists in the world there is no need for me to do this just for some irrelevant medal. You don't see Oscar Delahoya fighting for a trophy...he gets paid 30 million. Oh yeah, he does get a belt, maybe it's about the accessories for him ...not. So the price for my time would be much less than that let's say hmm ...$100,000, oh and a per diem if I have to fly in from Europe. Offer me this for my time and yes, I'll compete otherwise it would be pointless considering the professional status I have achieved.

Q: Who in your opinion are some of the top jugglers of this time?

A: Well, this is not in any kind of order but I would say Francoise Rochais, Paul Ponce, Mario Berousek, Kris Kremo, Picasso Jr., Dick Franco. There are a few more in Europe that I have great respect for as well.

Q: Who was your idol?

A: My idol was Francis Brunn, he was so divers as a juggler. He spent his early years working on higher numbers then made a transformation when he was in his 30's to a flamenco style with an action packed performance that just blows my mind every time I watch it on video. The esthetic nature of this artist can not be compared to anyone. So basically Francis could do it all you don't see these type of performers any more.

Q: Do you care that jugglers think negatively about you not showing up for conventions.

A: I attended these events and competed when I was a kid and grant it I had fun doing so. I have moved on to the professional world and time does not allow for it anymore. I think that if those jugglers that have these bad feelings could get work themselves you would not see them at conventions either....too bad for them.

Q: What do you think about other jugglers bashing you on there web sites?

A: I hate to answer a question with another question but isn't envy a sin?

Q: What is your ultimate goal as a juggler.

A: To keep working the best houses and to try and express my self poetically through juggling and entertaining.

These are the questions. If I have made some of you angry, sorry but you can't please everybody and if I have made some of you happy I am glad to have made a difference.
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WRITTEN BY ANTHONY GATTO

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